Member training from February 10th 2025. In our discussion tonight, we explored the growing trend of identifying as ‘spiritual but not religious,’ a concept that has gained traction in modern society, particularly within the entertainment industry. This movement often promotes the idea that traditional religions, especially Christianity, are restrictive and harmful, while spirituality is seen as liberating. However, we examined the underlying implications of this shift, that it leads to a rejection of moral principles that are essential for maintaining a free and just society. We highlighted how this spiritual movement is intertwined with broader agendas, including the New World Order, which seeks to undermine monotheism and promote a one-world religion devoid of true moral guidance. Ultimately, we emphasized that true liberty cannot exist without morality, and morality is deeply rooted in religious principles that have always provided a foundation for societal order and peace.

Another interesting book on the subject is “Get Married: Why Americans Must Defy the Elites, Forge Strong Families, and Save Civilization” By Brad Wilcox. You can get your copy by clicking on the title of the book.

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TRANSCRIPT

Heavenly Father, we are grateful to meet together tonight to discuss true principles
and the things we can do to Be free we pray for thy blessings and guidance as we
seek to do what is right say the name of Jesus Christ Amen. Amen. Thank you
and How that really does affect a free society and I hope as by the time we’re
done with this that it’ll be clear how this really does affect us as a free
society. Try to get rid of this box.
Yeah, OK. So as we see, this is a popular saying that we’re that I’m hearing more
and more often and it’s important for us to understand what it leads to. Here’s a
quote is I’m really I’m not religious. I would say I’m more spiritual than
religious. Paul McCartney says, I’m not religious, but I am spiritual.
And if you remember what the Beatles were doing during the 60s and early 70s, and
they’re pushed to India, that’ll make a lot of sense as we get into tonight’s
presentation. A lot of books coming out. This one’s titled, I’m spiritual, not
religious. Christina Aguilera says, I’m not really religious, but very spiritual.
Janet Jackson, I’m not really religious, but very spiritual. I don’t believe in
things like guilt.
Another book, spiritual, but not religious, spiritual, but not religious, spiritual.
I’m not religious. I’m spiritual. And so lots of different. This is the subtitle of
that book is shed your dogmatism and legalism in order to live meaningfully and
passionately. And so they’re trying to say that, you know, being religious is bad,
but being spiritual is good. And this is something that we see from the, of course,
those involved in the occult in the interstate in the entertainment industry. And the
occult is ultimately the origins of this concept of being spiritual,
but not religious. I’m
I’m going to mute my phone so it doesn’t come out like that
and so it’s origins start go back to Madame Blavatsky and she actually had a
magazine publication called Lucifer. She was the the founder of the Theosophical
Society its original name of the organization was the Lucifer Trust. And then it
became the Theosophical Society and their magazine was called Lucifer. So they didn’t,
you know, amongst themselves, they did not hide really who their master is. And so
they, they are worshipers of Satan while claiming to be spiritual. So getting more
of their origins. Another a person that was mentored by Madame Blavatsky,
Adam Annie Besant. And she wrote the book called Modern Socialism,
leading up to Karl Marx and the people around that time. And I talk about this a
lot in Invasion about the occult that William Godby was a part of and how that
leads the connections to Karl Marx with that as well. And so she wrote a book,
piggybacking off of Madame Lovatsi’s book of the secret doctrine called Theosophy and
the Theosophical Society, where she says Theosophy is the mysticism or esotericism
common to all religions thrown by Theosophy into a scientific form as in Hinduism,
Buddhism, Roman Catholic Christianity, and Sufism. Theosophy,
in a secondary sense, the above being the primary, is the body of doctrine obtained
by separating the beliefs common to all religions from the peculiarities,
specialities, rites, ceremonies, and customs which mark off one religion from another.
It presents these common truths as a consensus of world beliefs forming in their
entirety, the wisdom religion or the universal religion, the source from which all
separate religions spring, the trunk of the tree of life from which they all branch
forth. And so it’s claiming to be basically the truths of every other religion
grabbed from each of the different religions, put together into this new theology
called Theosophy.
And in there, they have a hatred of Christianity. So Rod, one of my cohorts has
raised his hand. Go ahead, Rod. Oh, I just want to mention, Sufism, a lot of
people don’t know what that is, that’s actually a mystical branch of Islam.
– Okay, thank you.
So with the raised hands again, we’re just gonna have you put your comment in the
chat and then I’ll let the co -hosts address it or let me know if it needs to be
addressed. So just to let you know. So in the Theosophical Society published
pamphlets to let people know about their beliefs and who they were, and they have a
deep hatred of Christianity. They wrote to challenge the materialism of science in
all forms of strict religious dogma, especially Christianity, which the society’s
leaders see as harmful. To reveal the suppressed truths about Eastern religious
philosophies, their ethics, chronology, and symbolism, and to counteract the misleading
efforts of missionaries toward non -Christians about the true origins and teachings of
Christianity and its effects on people in Christian countries. So,
you know, they pretend to say, “Okay, we grab the truths from Christianity and get
rid of the rest,” but really, they are claiming that Christianity has suppressed the
Eastern religions and that they don’t tell the truth about the effects of
Christianity on the population. And so their job is to expose the harmful nature of
Christianity. They see Christianity as harmful. Asoteric philosophy reconciles all
nations, Strips everyone of its outward human garments and shows the root of each to
be identical with that of every other great religion It has never rejected God in
nature nor deity as an absolute and abstract being So they they talk about of
course that reconciling again of all these different ideas and putting just stripping
them down to to to the root of everything is what their claim is while bagging on
Christianity and claiming to never reject God in nature. And we see that a lot in
spirituality is, you know, I don’t not believe in God. I just believe in,
you know, this abstract being out there. And so they, on one hand, they claim so
that that way they don’t push Christians and people that believe in God away, but
at the same time, their idea of God is basically this ether, whatever the powers of
the universe are. It only refuses to accept any of the gods of the so -called
monotheistic religions. So they do come out and say, yes, we do reject the gods of
Christianity, of Judaism, of hominism. Those are that we that they reject and we see
that the theosophic society started again by Madame Blavatsky and this is the the
symbol the logo of the theosophic society which is very occultish and this is the
room the only organization that’s allowed to have a prayer room within the United
Nations is Madame Blavatsky and her and the theotheosophic society’s prayer room.
And these other movements also have their roots in spiritualism. Energy healing and
that’s whether you call it energy releasing, Christ -centered energy healing, Reiki,
this crystal stuff, they have crystal witchcraft really what it comes down to is
it’s a form of witchcraft and all of these things which goes back to of course
because they believe in this paganism is with all of these other religions that
they’re coming together is they with their so -called healing powers it goes back to
witchcraft and the occult. And so the spirituality um actually has a roots in
socialism as well as we talked about earlier with Madame Blavatsky and I mentioned
how um she was a part of the training of um an individual by the name of Robert
Owen who then trained Karl Marx and Frederick Ingalls and so we have this broad
connection between the spirituality and socialism but there there’s also a direct
connection between spirituality and socialism. So I’m going to open it up real quick.
Does anybody recognize who who is this? You can unmute and chime in. Who is this?
Anybody recognize what this is? Those Jim Jones. Yeah.
And they’re the ones that, you know, that they call it, you know, you drink in the
Kool -Aid referencing the Jim Jones people and and Jones town and how they drank the
flavor aid and To all commit mass suicide Well before this happened
He was actually praised and he was actually Set up as a leader amongst the
theosophists and their spiritualism So in this book,
this is their monthly publication or I’m sorry yearly publication spiritual community
guide where they got into more in -depth of this being spiritual and not religious
and What are some of their goals and what are the some of the things that they’re
working on and how they’re doing it and So in the I think it was a 72 issue The
spiritual community guide they wrote Jim Jones’s role was to teach Christian socialism
in preparation for the new age. So the new age movement, spiritualism,
those are all interconnected. They’re all part of the same movement and they have
their different tentacles out there whose job is to promote different parts of this
new world order, this religious aspect of the New World Order. So spiritualism and
the New Age is the religious aspect, the one -world religion aspect of the New World
Order that we think of typically along political lines,
but to be able to get everybody on board, they also have to have their spiritual
lines, which promotes the political part of it, like they have here, Jim Jones’s job
was to promote socialism in bringing out the new age of the new world order. And
so Alice Bailey was another person that was trained by Madame Blavatsky and was a
mentor of Madame Blavatsky, no, Madame Blavatsky mentored Alice Bailey and wrote the
book The
externalization of the hierarchy and talking about its connection to the New World
Order where she writes the New World Order will be founded on the recognition that
all men are equal in origin and goal, but that all are at differing stages of
evolutionary development. Okay, so again,
using the spiritual to implement the political and how we see here, everybody’s
equal. Now we have the Declaration of Independence that says all men are created
equal and they are endowed by their creator by certain inalienable rights. And so in
that sense of equality, it is, you know, the government has no ability and no
authority to be able to prevent somebody from exercising their God -given rights.
But here, they’re saying that we’re all equal, but that all are at differing stages
of evolutionary development. So if you have that in effect, that means they get to
treat different people.
Some people, some animals are more equal than others, would be, I guess, the most
simple way to put that, where because that there’s stayed different stages of
evolutionary development, again, promoting the antichrist doctrine of evolution.
But in addition to that, saying because of their different stages of evolutionary
development, there are different levels of control, just like children, you know,
anybody under the age of 18, they can’t get a tattoo or get a credit card or join
the military without a parent’s permission.
If your evolutionary development is not at the stage that they feel is enlightened
enough, then of course they get to step in. So the New World Order is going to be
founded upon this idea of the government being able to step in depending on what
your evolutionary development is.
So also spirituality promotes drug use. And so we have these different ideas of LSD,
magic mushrooms, DMT, these are all promoted by these spiritualists as ways to get
to a higher plane, to be able to access spirits from another realm, to be able to
access a higher plane of reality, supposedly. And, you know, some people will promote
this idea that it’s, you that the conspiracy is trying to shut this stuff down
because they want to control us and they don’t want us to reach these higher levels
of consciousness. But what’s really going on is what we see is state legislators,
even in Utah, have actually introduced legislation to legalize magic mushrooms.
And they have worked on also legalizing acid. And so we see lots of different
states across the country that are legalizing these drugs.
And what really going on, it wasn’t that we’re finally overcoming the oppressiveness
of the past. It’s that the fact that it wasn’t the conspiracy trying to shut down
spirituality. It was our common sense of morality that said, you know, these are not
up to our community standards. We are not going to allow these things in our
community because we see the dangers that they pose, and they remove people’s free
will to be able to make their own choices. And so now they’re, they’re, they’re
basically like a child where they are no longer in control of their faculties. And
so we need to make sure that these things don’t happen so that everybody has their
freedom and is not affected by the dangerous side effects of these drugs. And so we
see this new age spiritualism and of course the conspiracy is working to introduce
the mass distribution of these drugs as we saw during the 80s the CIA in
distributing cocaine in the inner cities and things along those lines.
The conspiracy wants people to get on these drugs and to make these drugs as a
normal part of society as we’re starting to see with these drugs and others.
And so the spirituality movement in encouraging these are actually a way to encourage
really demon possession and to be able to remove the person’s ability to maintain
and their agency, their ability to be able to control their own actions.
And so part of the spirituality movement is to remove self -control and agency from
the individual, and drugs is one of the ways to do that. And so we see that
spirituality, of course, leads to one world religion. One world religion equals no
true religion. And so they are using this idea of being spiritual,
not religious, to get the population to reject the
barriers that religion puts on us because those are time -tested principles that have
protected society against the cultures that were immoral that led to chaos,
crime, immorality, and the licentiousness, and the results in the society that leads
to which we’re going to get to in a second, those specific results that happen to
society when we become spiritual, not religious. But before we do that,
I think this is a good time to take a little, just a pause and get any comments,
thoughts, questions that we’ve had so far. Anybody want to chime in?
Now, this is Mark. Yeah, there’s so many things I’d like to mention, but go back
going back to spirituality. What’s very clear is they’re saying no dogma,
no beliefs, no law, no God’s law. So you can have God, But you can’t have any
anything he says you can’t obey him. You can’t follow it any any of his laws
There’s no ethics there. There’s no detail that Christian ethics or any other ethics,
you know, Nate sure Forbes or Forbes a vacuum Anybody study a little physics and so
something moves in there and what moves in there is the devil, but yeah,
I think that’s really important to realize that they’re saying you cannot practice
anything of morality. There’s there’s no good or evil. So and God’s not good.
God’s not evil. He’s just there. The devil’s not good. He’s not evil. He’s just
there because you can’t practice any dogma. But the other thing I wanted to mention
there with drugs. Actually, I think it’s just the opposite of the way you’re
presenting it, Ben. Okay, that’s fair enough. You can disagree. That’s fine. People
have a right to decide what they, if they own their body,
they have a right to put what’s in it. You can’t keep your body to God if you
don’t already own it. And so, and you’re taking away partial ownership to somebody
who decides to put something in their body, whether it’s something relatively innocent
like marijuana or something that’s dangerous. So society, the way you phrase it,
society should decide, the community should decide, the community is a collective, a
collective decides, that’s exactly a foundation of Marxism, communism, that the group
decides group rights, collective rights, individual rights, the individual should decide
what goes into his body or not. Now, if he wants to be informed by like God’s
law, now God’s law is different, but in a free society, you have to have the right
to choose what you want. And that’s the foundation of our country who’s founder upon
it. You know, there were no… Well, the Founding Fathers actually were very much to
disagree with that. That’s why they allowed different states to be able to, you
know, have those types of sumptuary laws amongst themselves and many of the states
that were founded by the, you know, the founding fathers and they held right the
Constitution, they had those sumptuary laws because they recognize that on the local
level that they had the not only the right but the ability because as we’ve talked
about and I’ve mentioned many many times before is that it is essential that
everybody in a society to maintain peace has to have a, you know,
an agreement a perfect agreement on what the rules of government are. – Yeah,
and that’s in the constitution. It’s right there in the second paragraph. The only
rule of government is to protect them, the individual from its individual right.
– Right, and so that’s to the national government. – And it doesn’t talk about
limiting freedoms at all. And so that’s the ideology that the state should be
practicing many states did. Camp uh marijuana was legal throughout the whole country
when it was uh the nation i’m not i’m not talking about marijuana specifically i
didn’t mention that but it is a part of the conspiracy is to demoralize the people
and the founding fathers only delegated that’s why it’s not in the constitution
because it is the because that was just a delegation of certain authority to a
central body whereas everything else was retained to the states jefferson Washington,
Adams, Massachusetts, Virginia, they all had sumptuary laws. And the end of,
you know, Thomas Jefferson, who wrote the Declaration of Independence, saw no problem
with that on the local level. They understood the importance of morality to
maintaining free government. And so they took steps to ensure that morality was
implemented. Or, you know, they’re what, what the there and if you didn’t believe in
what their form of morality was then you had the right to leave and to associate
with others that had the same morality as you did because they knew that according
they had to have a society based on biblical laws otherwise they would tend towards
tyranny that those those little different those those different restraints were vital
to preventing the big attacks on your liberty when a society devolved into um
immorality and anarchy and so that’s that’s what that’s the what we see the record
of the founding fathers and not just one or two of them but even the ones that
are seen as strictly libertarian like thomas jefferson and so they so they really
had a different record on that on the local level But I think overall we can then
we can agree definitely that that with this new idea of spirituality New ageism is
getting rid of God and what the result of getting rid of God is in society is
dangerous to everyone’s liberty
Yeah, well, there’s several points here one is you’re we’re not talking about
encouraging the use You’re actually arguing for immorality because you’re Compromising
way liberty if you compromise it at all you’re not going to have liberty you’re
going to have tyranny So you’re actually advocating for tyranny Taking away people’s
individual choices that aren’t affecting and harming anybody else So I think it’s
just the opposite of what you’re saying and whether it’s some Founders believe with
you or not. It doesn’t matter. It’s what God says and what logic says, okay?
Definitely I’d like to say something on that issue, too.
I think people cry a lot for, well, not as much as they should, but people cry a
lot for liberty, freedom, whatever, but the thought is like,
what does that really mean? Like, what is freedom in its most fundamental form.
And you can argue all kinds of things in particulars. But I think the most prudent
way to really define what freedom is, is to put it into a sentence.
And then that would be freedom from evil. And so, and one of the key components of
evil is the destruction morality. Part of the destruction morality is the destruction
of people’s cognitive abilities to choose, which certainly drugs do.
And we all know that drugs increase crime, increase immorality. It’s not even
debatable. It’s just a straight -up fact. Well, the founding doctors just agreed with
you. They said it in the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence. Mark,
Go ahead. Now Congress agreed with that. The role of government is solely, solely.
Mark, we’re going to mute you because we’re moving on on this. Because we can all
agree on the fact that a society that has a drug culture is going to be a society
that degenerates and into slavery. And so whether you want to be in a society that
outlaws drugs or doesn’t outlaw drugs, that’s a different point. The point is a
society that makes drugs popular and rampant is a society that degrades into tyranny.
That’s just a fact. Is that the role of government? That’s a role of your religion.
That’s not the role of the front. So we’ll just, yeah, and anybody can,
we can debate that and have a discussion on that another time, but I think that
the overall arching issue is what happens when you have that in society. So we’ll
go ahead and move on to the next part of the topic, is spiritually is the idol of
self. And so this is really what it breaks down to, is the worship of the self,
as Mark pointed out very eloquently, that it is the getting rid of God’s laws. And
so if you don’t have God’s laws, that means you have to make up your own. And so
you’re idolizing yourself as the ultimate law giver. it’s a form of a golden calf.
A golden calf cannot set up its own rules. You’re the one that decides what the
golden calf says the rules are. And of course, it’s ultimately a worship of self.
And spirituality is a form of Satanism. We look at even atheism as a form of
Satanism because they hate God. Atheists claim to not believe in God, but we see
with their own logos that they are mocking the idea of Christianity and their
materials. They don’t not believe in God. They they hate God. And so they are
establishing a society that is godless, which spirituality is an outgrowth from
because they know that, you know, I’m going to get into this in a minute, is that
it is the natural inclination of an individual to understand and recognize that there
is a God. And so their job is to get rid of that natural law within ourselves of
worship of a deity. And this really gets breaks down to, so if they hate God,
they’re getting us to worship ourselves. That is what Satanism is all about. Satan
wanted to dethrone God. He wanted all of us to worship him instead of God. And so
spirituality, idol worship, and atheism are all really, when you break them down to
their fundamentals, is Satanism. And if we understand that, then we will start to
see the dangers of spirituality versus being religious. So for further study in this
concept of spirituality, I recommend these two books, The Hidden Dangers of the
Rainbow, and Unmasking the New Age, is there a new religious movement trying to form
society. Those really get into having a lot of documentation and getting the details
of the New Age movement of spiritualism. And so George Washington,
again, he says that it is it is religion and morality are vital supports to free
government. And so he says, let us with caution, indulge this supposition that
morality can be maintained without religion. So We need religion in society because
religion is what produces morality and if you have and if you have morality Then
you can have a free government So if you don’t have religion you don’t have
morality and you don’t have a free government those three things are inseparably
connected to each other and Getting into Puffendorf’s book the duty of man He says
amongst those notions that every man ought to have of God, the first of all, that
he firmly believes his existence. That is, that there is indeed some supreme being
upon whom this universe depends. Okay, that is the first notion that we have.
We believe in his existence, which if any man denies himself to be able to
comprehend, he is not therefore to be excused for his atheism. So, we can’t excuse
somebody for their atheism because they’re denying just himself. For all mankind,
having been perpetually, as it were, possessed of this persuasion,
that man who undertakes to oppose it ought not only solidly to confute all those
arguments that are brought to prove a God, but should advance reasons for his own
assertion which may be more plausible than those. So basically what he’s getting into
is that it’s just it’s perpetually in our nature to be possessed of the persuasion
to believe in God, to know of his existence. And so we don’t really need to, at
that point, we don’t need to prove God because we don’t need to prove what is
naturally obvious. He goes on to continue as it says, “Since by this belief of the
deity, the wheel of mankind may be supposed to have been hitherto preserved, he
ought to show that atheism would better answer that end than sober religion and the
worship of God.” Now, seeing this can by no means be done, the wickedness of those
men who attempt any way to eradicate this persuasion out of the minds of men is to
be above all things abominated and restrained by the severest punishment.
So this man, read by the Founding Fathers, quoted by the Founding Fathers, this book
was what they read and what they studied to be able to decide what kind of society
we want to have, either both on the national level or the confederated republic
level, as well as on the local level, whether that be city or state and that
atheism of course the idea of getting rid of God in society was something that need
to be just shunned at all costs and so he continues on he says the external
worship of God is chiefly shown in these instances this is how we this is how we
show our worship of God just you know irregardless of what denomination you are,
these are the basics of showing our devotion to God in society. We must render
thanks to God and for all the manifold blessings, he is so bound to be bestowed
upon us. We must conform as far as we possibly can, all our actions to his will,
that is we must obey all his commands. And with new age movement, with spirituality,
there are no commands, because that’s religion. And so it is obviously clear,
self -evident, that to recognize a God, he has laws that we must conform to.
We must admire and adore his infinite greatness. Otherwise, why are you going to
obey him? We must offer up to him our prayers and supplications to obtain from him
those benefits we stand in need of, and to be delivered from those evils we are in
fear of. When we find it necessary to take an oath, we must swear by no other
name than the name of God, and then we most religiously observe that what we have
engaged ourselves in to calling God to witness. So we want to show, if we’re going
to actually go that far to say we’re swearing to God, we’re saying that we’re
calling him to witness what we’re doing, and so That is the seriousness of it.
We are a blasphemer if we are going to violate that. And blaspheming is of course
one of the most serious of crimes. We must never speak of God but with the highest
respect and upmost reverence. So making sure that we don’t treat holy things lightly,
that we only speak of them in a reverent way. Whatsoever is done for the sake of
God or an obedience to his will ought to be done after such a manner as most
proper to express The profound honor we have for him Number eight.
We must serve and worship him not only in private But in public in the sight of
men giving testimony to our devotion and excite others to do the same So we read
in the Gospels right not to do your alms before men that way you’re not just
you’re not trying to get credit for yourself but here he’s saying to worship him
publicly so I think those aren’t in contradiction but what he’s saying is that when
we are worshiping God we do it in public because that is a testimony to others
when we hide our devotion to God it is hard for others to see the benefits of it
the blessings of it and and they might think that they’re alone and so they will
be more apt to falling for being made fun of for believing in God and so we can
be a strength to others in our public observance and worship of God. We are to use
our utmost endeavor to observe the laws of nature as it is an affront to slight
the commands of God. So the laws of nature are the laws of God and so when we
break ourselves against God’s laws, we are basically being in a front to God.
And so as far as we can, and when we fail, we need to repent and do better.
But it is one of the ways that we, of course, apply this religious aspect that is
so important to liberty. This is how it’s applied.
And further on in this book is, if you don’t have it, I really highly recommend
it. He says, it might be helpful to think more clearly about the benefits that
religion provides to society. So he’s saying, so, okay, after we’ve done all that,
let’s look at the benefits that religion provides to us when it’s made a part of
the whole. Religion is truly the strongest and most important bond holding humanity
together. Without the fear of a higher power in a state of natural freedom, any
strong person might harm weaker individuals without hesitation. So the Founding
Fathers, they got together, they believe this all together even though they were of
different denominations, they understood that religion was the strongest and most
important bond holding them together. They would see honesty,
modesty, and truth as meaningless, and would ignore any argument that urges them to
act morally. This is exactly what we see going on with the New Age movement and
with spirituality.
There’s no such thing, you know, modesty is especially out the window.
Instead, they would only follow what is right if they feel unable to do otherwise.
So if they get caught, they’re in a situation they don’t want to look bad, they
all of a sudden, without religion, the morality becomes situational, depending on the
topic. And when they’re, you know, when they’re having a disagreement, they don’t
think that the laws of God are something that they want to follow, they will just
say, well, that’s not my truth. And that’s where this, you know, this idea of a
non -stagnant, static truth, that truth is in the eye of the beholder,
whereas when we have religion, we understand that truth is eternal no matter when
and where you are. Moreover, without religion, people would be much more likely to
harm each other. In a world where legal systems only deal with hard evidence, secret
wrongdoings that could be hidden would often be seen as clever tricks. So we see
this in societies today that are irreligious. Those societies are, you’re afraid to
go to those countries because you know you can get robbed, you might get kidnapped,
you might get killed. And so we just see the natural fact that that is a society,
either even if you go to a country or even in America, you go to these cities
where religion is not a part of that city’s culture and the crime that is prevalent
there compared to cities where religion is a important integration of their society,
where you are actually, everyone feels safe, you leave your doors locked at night.
He says also that no one would do charitable acts or good deeds unless they
expected recognition or reward these transactional relationships. I’m doing something
nice for you because I expect you to do something nice for me, as opposed to I’m
doing something because it’s the right thing to do. As a result, without the fear
of punishment from a higher power, people would constantly live in fear and must
trust of one another, worried about being cheated or hurt. Governors and rulers would
be just as bad as the people they govern. Now you just, we see that in society
today, you look at, you go back to the 90s even, and how everyone was going after
Bill Clinton with Monica Lewinsky and how important, you know, conservatives would say
or morality is important with our leaders. We can’t have a leader that is going to
be a moral. And then you had people that were, of course, you know, this is the
left -right paradigm that was being presented to us. But you had the Democrats saying
that morality, private morality is separate from you know public duty and there’s no
connection between the two and so that has been the idea that was presented by the
Democrats during the 90s is something that now both parties have an embraced and
they don’t expect nor desire a person that is privately moral any more than they
would publicly and so we see the result of that in society today. Without any moral
obligation, rulers would sell out their offices and even justice for personal gain,
oppressing their subjects and weakening them to prevent rebellion. Do we not see that
in society today? In turn, the people would always fear their rulers’ violence and
would seek ways to rebel, but would also distrust one another, making society
In moral culture leads to immoral leaders leads to fear of violence and fear of
your neighbor, fear of violence from government, fear of violence from your neighbor.
You cannot separate those things from each other. It is foolish for those who claim
to be wise and political to promote looseness and irreligion as they fail to see
how much religion helps to maintain order and peace.
What he was doing was he was just observing what happens in nature,
just what is something that is self -evident and obvious. And as he looked at
different societies and different cultures, what was it that led to one thing? What
was it to lead to another? And he just wrote down what the natural consequence of
both was. To an honest person, this is as undebatable as arguing about the color of
a clear blue sky. And we look at what happened to those that looked to their own
understanding, right? We see with Moses, those Moses said that if they just looked
to the brass servant that they would be healed. But you can almost say that these
people that didn’t obey and they said well you know that’s that’s your truth or
that you know i’m a spiritual person not a religious person i’m going to see what
you know makes sense to me as opposed to hey you know what god has laws god has
rules that he sets forward and that he sets part people to to do so and so when
we reject god’s laws and how he reveals truth and we reject those as they are
manifest through natural society, we see the results of them and that’s exactly what
the conspiracy wants. They want us to become irreligious and to be so -called
spiritual because they know they can’t get rid of this nature that we have inside
of us to recognize a higher power and so they want to just make it this ambiguous
self -worshipping spirituality as opposed to religion. And again as I stated earlier
there is no liberty without morality and there is no morality without religion. We
have to make sure that we do not fall for the lies that are being put out there
that say that we can separate those things and that they don’t matter because it is
clear by the scriptures, by the founding fathers that we respect and the natural law
thinkers that they quoted and they read from and establish their society. And as we
look at society as a whole, these things are here, indisputable facts,
and they’re irrefutable.
And so let’s go ahead and open up what it looks like.
We got a lot of comments in there, but we got a few minutes because this gave us
a gap has gave us 10 minutes to kind of have a discussion. ask questions feel free
to raise your hand and we can go one at a time of comments or questions that you
may have about the topics that we covered tonight.
I don’t know how to raise my hand will this work? It’ll work you didn’t hear from
me good. Okay I’m gonna with my ADD I’m gonna go jump way back on the drug thing.
Okay I I think an immoral society drugs are the number one thing.
Here in Utah, it’s supposed to be one of the top states for antidepressants.
Yep. So we’re all– I’m not going to say we.
There’s a lot of drugged up people in Utah. The next thing I want to say is,
I made some comments, but I wasn’t sure they were clear. So it’s a drug to these
people to have the feeling that they’re smarter than God himself,
that they would do anything to destroy the morals of the people.
I don’t usually watch
award programs, but my daughter and I was watching, I don’t know if it was gobs or
whatever. And while I was watching the people, it reminded me of J.
Lowe wore a dress, it looked like it was taped on her many years ago. Lady Gaga
wore steaks on her, mead on her.
And it seemed like the morals were so bad that now They’re not they don’t want to
have a Malfunction like jenna jackson did on the Super Bowl,
but they all want to push the limits as far as they can And and that’s as the
immoral as you can get Yeah, but the immorality Our immorality today is much like
the children of Israel during Moses’ time. It’s we’re smarter than God.
We don’t have to listen to him. And if we do listen to him,
then we’re gonna have Aaron or what was the, what was most, Maryam,
you’re gonna have someone else say something. And that fits today because President
Nielsen says things that we know don’t go along with the scriptures. And so we make
up excuses that maybe we don’t have to follow what God has said. Now,
I’ll go back to my ADD and turn off.
Okay.
That’s sad, Denise, that somebody would say that. It’s horrible.
So she just talking to most didn’t see it. She was saying yeah Can I explain for
a sec? Yeah, please go ahead. Oh Sorry, yeah, so I guess when you were describing
that about Clinton and how it came nor became normal for Well,
that was his private life so it doesn’t matter because you know that’s not his
public life and so we that exact reasoning a friend I he’s really very religious
very you know I just think of him as a good man but yet we kind of we actually
debated at a caucus on abortion And he used that reasoning because he said to
support abortion. And he wouldn’t come out right and say he supports abortion,
of course. But I had said how I don’t support it or whatever,
because that was the question. And we had to go in a line and answer. but then he
went in this whole roundabout way of, well, I do not support abortion,
but I cannot put on someone else and like, oh, in my private life,
I would, I just, you know, but he really roundabout way came around to,
but it’s okay that someone else, he’s not gonna force his ideals on someone else,
right? So to me, if it makes sense that when you explain that private versus
public, it made sense to me that that’s the reasoning he was using to actually
support abortion, though he wouldn’t come out right ever and say he supports
abortion. Right. You would just say, Oh, that’s, you know, I wouldn’t do that. But
whatever you do in the privacy of, you know, you’re with your doctor, that’s up to
you. And, you You know, to me, that’s the same thing because it’s murder is murder.
And so it’d be like saying, well, I’m not gonna kill my spouse, but if what you
do with your spouse, you know, you kill them in the privacy of your own home,
that’s, you know, you do you. That’s what that mindset leads to.
Yeah. Moses just said it matters more what you do in private than what you do in
public, but that’s who you really are.
Mark go ahead.
Yeah a few quick points. I’ll go quickly through these. I’m gonna give you my kind
of agreeable expanding on Points on expanding. Okay, you’ve said first of all,
there’s nothing as close to an innate
Human quality or bleed than that in a deity. They’ve seen it in cultures from the
very beginning of mankind, of human beings, believing in a deity or deities like the
Romans, many gods. So that goes along with this,
what you were saying, and on that point,
public practice of our religion, it’s mandated a number of times in the scriptures,
where evangelism is a public display of religion, you’re going to church that’s
required in the scripture, that’s a public display, so there’s a great commission
because that’s a public display, so I think that’s really important. Just one they’ve
been on the drugs. Price drink, alcohol, alcohol is wine,
it’s a drug. Anyway, but one of the, oh,
on Clinton, I think if you can measure sins, the greater sin from a political
perspective of somebody who should be present is his deceit, his fraud, his lie,
his lie to God when he took his marriage vows,
that I think that’s the greatest because we shouldn’t have liars in the presidency
and that’s all we’re getting these days and centuries.
But one concern I have, I see this among some, I see it in the talk show I
called out into the host and I’ve seen it many times and it’s a very disturbing
trend People are just getting more and more lazy reading understanding God’s law and
what they Seem to do instead. They say we got gotta be open and let God guide us
in our meditations and our prayers and as once through our prayers so in a way
that’s a not only a discounting it’s an abrogation of our of our responsibility to
follow the laws to just say well I’ll just open up and let God direct me and that
that’s very close to what many people define spirituality is just let the God talk
to you well I think probably say it’s going to be talking to you more than God
is. Well exactly yeah that’s something that happens people are too wary of And
because they like you said they’re too lazy to know what God’s laws are then they
are and they’re they’re just saying I’m gonna take whatever you know, the universe
tells me to do and what they end up doing is listening to a you know A false
revelation. I there’s a saying that I like a lot as you can tell a a bad angel
or a false revelation Because it contradicts a former one. Well, how are you going
to know what a what a former one is if you’re not doing your duty to study them?
You you’re gonna unmute again mark
there. There’s a trend among some denominations and some more than others to just
discount parts of the law Yeah, you know There is no hell that’s been torn out of
the Bible, numbered denominations. There’s several at homosexuality and so forth.
So that’s contributing to this problem to ignore the law and just sit back and let
some spirit talk to you, whether it’s God or Satan. That’s the big unbuttoning
again. Is that okay? Let’s go ahead and Alan, just hold off. We’re going to have a
closing prayer and then you can butt in. We’ll have an open forum and everybody can
talk about whatever they want. Let’s go ahead and have a open forum.
And Denise Croft, would you say the closing prayer force?
Okay, thanks.
Dear Heavenly Father, we’re grateful for this day and that we could meet again
together in our Liberty Tree Society to learn of truths and that have been
presented. We’re grateful for Ben and his time and help us to all continue to study
out in our own hearts and minds so that we can always find what real truth is not
be deceived on um the way that they say today are personal truths but know that
real truth is out there and it comes from thee and help us all to diligently seek
it especially in the matters of liberty and we thank thee for all of our blessings
and may the may thy spirit be with all of us that are on this call throughout the
week and we say things name I send Jesus Christy mine